I just need to get this off my chest, you don't have to read or respond

[coasterqueen]

QUOTE (DansMom @ Jan 14 2004, 01:45 PM)

I agree with Schnoogly that it doesn't sound like dairy allergy/sensitivity, based on what you've described, but anything is worth a try. Usually she would have shown other symptoms like distress after eating, skin conditions, bad diarrhea with rash, or a histamine reaction. It is hard enough to raise a non-HN child---non-HN moms like me may feel like we relate to what you describe, or we may experience some aspects of what you're going through, but we would have to put exponents on everything to know what it's like. As exhausted as I am with my situation, I can only imagine that having an HN child would make me feel either homicidal or catatonic most of the time. I hope that things get better or that you find some way to get a few nights of sleep.

You know what though? I may have a HN child and you may not, but one thing is for sure....we all handle life and our situations so differently so it doesn't mean you don't understand or *feel* like you are going thru a similar situation. Did that make any sense? LOL.

[DansMom]

QUOTE (boogabearzmom @ Jan 14 2004, 02:49 PM)

You know what though? I may have a HN child and you may not, but one thing is for sure....we all handle life and our situations so differently so it doesn't mean you don't understand or *feel* like you are going thru a similar situation. Did that make any sense? LOL.

Yes, it makes sense

[coasterqueen]

QUOTE (DansMom @ Jan 14 2004, 01:52 PM)

QUOTE (boogabearzmom @ Jan 14 2004, 02:49 PM) You know what though?  I may have a HN child and you may not, but one thing is for sure....we all handle life and our situations so differently so it doesn't mean you don't understand or *feel* like you are going thru a similar situation.  Did that make any sense?  LOL. Yes, it makes sense

LOL. I'm not sure if I read it and it makes sense. Glad you do. I meant it to be "good"

[Kaitlin'smom]

wheeew reading all that makes me exausted! I really dunno how you do it, I admire your strength and offer tons of support. I need to night ween Kaitlin she wakes up one sometimes twice and she want to nurse, its seems to be the only way will will get back to sleep, she was puting her self back to sleep for a while then she started teething again, and in order for me to sleep and function I just give in. I also have a hard time letting DH take her when so is upset I cant take the crying and calling mamamama, I really try and let him comfort her but if she does not calm down after 15-20min I go get her and instantly she is fine. The other thing that is hard for me to let him take her is she will fight him and sometimes slap him at night when she just wants mommy, I feel bad when she does that. I am planing on tryin it this weekend, I just have to be prepaid for some sleepless nights....than I have to work on the other what I call bad habit I started with her.....sorry for my rambling and what seems to be my own problems.

I want to just help and hug all who need it and I could I would travel around and give moms a break they soooo need.

[Schnoogly]

You know what's funny, or maybe not funny, dealing with HN is TONS harder than heart surgery. I am serious--yeah our first 4 months or so were agonizing waiting for surgeries and of course watching him like a hawk, the panic attacks when I thought his color was bad, etc.

But then his heart was fixed, and we've been so lucky that he has been healthy.


The HN, on the other hand, is a daily grueling He!!. The months of never putting him down, never being alone with DH for even one minute, peeing with a baby on your shoulder, eating whatever you can stuff in your mouth with one hand, the endless hours of rocking and nursing and bouncing and BEGGING please, please go to sleep. That has been much harder, SO MUCH harder. So I don't know if it makes you feel better, esp. because people would never equate heart surgery with HN, but HN is harder. If I had 3 wishes, my first wish would not be that he never needed another heart surgery. That would be my second wish. My first wish would be that he were LESS intense, LESS persistent, LESS sensitive, LESS everything. I would wish for mellowness. (The third wish would either be Jodie Foster's body or a lot of cash, not sure LOL)

Also, I definitely wished the doc would tell me that he had reflux or whatever and give me zantac and he would magically turn into a happy, smiley baby overnight. I kwym. And I have heard another mom say that the allergy testing really isn't that bad, so I really hope you get some answers!! I suspect allergies here too--DH is massively allergic and I am the ezcema queen. But going to the doctor provokes 2 weeks of He!! for us (I can't really blame him for that), so I'm going to wait.

[kimberley]

as for the screaming, i also was told that james had nothing medically wrong with him because he would calm down when he was held some of the time. he does have allergies and acute eczema (developed around 18mos) but he has been HN since birth and i honestly think his eczema is stress related.

i totally KWYM about wondering where you went wrong. his dad and i fought a lot during pg and i blame myself all the time that we caused him to come out so angry. then he was so tiny when he was born i was afraid to break him and wonder if i didn't bond enough with him then... there are a million things i have done since he was conceived til now that i think could be why he is so HN. but like i said before, i really don't think it is anything we did... they are just born "spirited" (as schnoogly put it).

as for Attachment Parenting, i have APed with all 3 of my kids and James is the only high needs baby.

i really hope things get better for you sooner than it did for us.

[DansMom]

When I was new to this site, I really didn't know anything about HN babies. Now I know a lot more, and it's clear to me that Daniel is not HN. He has normal separation anxiety issues, and is fairly adaptable. He would be po'd if I went away for a whole night, he clearly prefers me and clamors for me when I'm around, but he's not desperate and enraged about things (except nose suctioning), he's charming with other caregivers and he doesn't throw tantrums for very long (maybe 30 seconds)---he adjusts pretty well to change and the unexpected these days, although I wasn't sure for a while there how he would be with that. The only issue I can say I understand completely is the demand to nurse frequently overnight and how hard it is to get up and go to work, get the pump supplies together, being exhausted at work and not performing well, having it affect interactions with DH and all that. I've been buying lotto tickets like they're going out of style---hoping for some kind of rescue from this 40 hour work week.

[coasterqueen]

QUOTE (DansMom @ Jan 14 2004, 02:22 PM)

When I was new to this site, I really didn't know anything about HN babies. Now I know a lot more, and it's clear to me that Daniel is not HN. He has normal separation anxiety issues, and is fairly adaptable. He would be po'd if I went away for a whole night, he clearly prefers me and clamors for me when I'm around, but he's not desperate and enraged about things (except nose suctioning), he's charming with other caregivers and he doesn't throw tantrums for very long (maybe 30 seconds)---he adjusts pretty well to change and the unexpected these days, although I wasn't sure for a while there how he would be with that. The only issue I can say I understand completely is the demand to nurse frequently overnight and how hard it is to get up and go to work, get the pump supplies together, being exhausted at work and not performing well, having it affect interactions with DH and all that. I've been buying lotto tickets like they're going out of style---hoping for some kind of rescue from this 40 hour work week.

I need to invest in lotto tickets. DH keeps asking me what would help and I tell him "win the lotto so I can afford to stay home" LOL.

You know what is really weird is there are 2 people Kylie is a complete angel for, well *most* of the time and that is her sitter and Dh's cousin Trent. Weird? Like Kylie will take naps for Terri (our sitter) and most of the time she is in good mood, most of the time, but then she gets home and BAMN another child appears Trent is another one. She could sit on his lap for hours watching tv and not move or make a peep. I've begged, pleaded, offered money, threatened, you name it I done whatever I could to convince him to come live with us, lol. He won't. I even offered to marry him, lol. That didn't work either

[MommyToAshley]

QUOTE

Kylie does scream mostly because she doesn't know what she wants either. I think that's the problem, lol.

I just thought about you when I was feeding Ashley her snack. I wonder if offering some choices would help? Ashley is obviously a different child, she is not HN, she is happy most of the time, and she is not clingy. But, she does come with some challenges. In fact, one of them is that she is too independant and wants to do EVERYTHING herself... from changing her diaper, to picking out her clothes, to putting on her clothes, to opening her applesauce, to putting her own toys in the bathtub, to picking out her bedtime book. The problem comes when she gets frustrated because she can't do something. How is she going to open her own applesauce when I have a hard time getting it open. But, she wants to do it herself. It gets to be frustrating. It is more than just that... if I hold out her pants for her to put her left leg in, then she wants to put her right leg in. So, what I have found is that by offering some choices whenever possible eases the tension at other times. For example, at snack time I will ask her if she wants applesauce or peaches and she will say or point to the one she wants. Then, she doesn't seem to mind when I open it. At diaper time, I have to give her the diaper to open, pulll open the tags, and then she tries to put it on her bottom... but I finish putting it on. It makes diaper changing a little easier. At naptime, it's not, "do you want to take a nap" but "do you want Mommy or Daddy to give you a nap?" Or "Do you want your Pooh Bear or Bunny to nap with you?" I didn't think of this myself, I read it somewhere. Although I wonder sometimes if I am doing the right thing. Am I teaching her that she will always get her way.... she will always get peaches when she wants peaches. Or, am I teaching her that she can have choices as long as she follows the rules... she can choose between peaches and applesauce at snacktime but she can't have cookies and mommy gets to help open the container.

Sorry to have rambled again, but I guess what I am wondering is if the same solution would work for different problems. I wonder if you give Kylie a choice between two things when she is like this if it will help her to decide what she wants?

[coasterqueen]

QUOTE (MommyToAshley @ Jan 14 2004, 02:57 PM)

QUOTE Kylie does scream mostly because she doesn't know what she wants either. I think that's the problem, lol. I just thought about you when I was feeding Ashley her snack. I wonder if offering some choices would help? Ashley is obviously a different child, she is not HN, she is happy most of the time, and she is not clingy. But, she does come with some challenges. In fact, one of them is that she is too independant and wants to do EVERYTHING herself... from changing her diaper, to picking out her clothes, to putting on her clothes, to opening her applesauce, to putting her own toys in the bathtub, to picking out her bedtime book. The problem comes when she gets frustrated because she can't do something. How is she going to open her own applesauce when I have a hard time getting it open. But, she wants to do it herself. It gets to be frustrating. So, what I have found is that by offering some choices whenever possible eases the tension at other times. For example, at snack time I will ask her if she wants applesauce or peaches and she will say or point to the one she wants. Then, she doesn't seem to mind when I open it. At diaper time, I have to give her the diaper to open, pulll open the tags, and then she tries to put it on her bottom... but I finish putting it on. It makes diaper changing a little easier. At naptime, it's not, "do you want to take a nap" but "do you want Mommy or Daddy to give you a nap?" Or "Do you want your Pooh Bear or Bunny to nap with you?" I didn't think of this myself, I read it somewhere. Although I wonder sometimes if I am doing the right thing. Am I teaching her that she will always get her way.... she will always get peaches when she wants peaches. Or, am I teaching her that she can have choices as long as she follows the rules... she can choose between peaches and applesauce at snacktime but she can't have cookies and mommy gets to help open the container. Sorry to have rambled again, but I guess what I am wondering is if the same solution would work for different problems. I wonder if you give Kylie a choice between two things when she is like this if it will help her to decide what she wants?

Who knows but it is worth a try? I know we ask her "do you want to go night, night" "do you want to eat", etc, etc. And we either get screams or we get "No". Everything is "No" right now. She doesn't understand the meaning of "Yes" although she can say it.

She still doesn't have a lot of words for things but she tells me she wants "whawha" when she wants her sippy but it seems more and more she screams and points to it. Sometimes we will be holding her and in the kitchen and she's pointing to something on the counter and screaming and we can't figure out what it is she wants. We point to EVERYTHING and she still points and screams. I really just think she doesn't know what she wants, lol.

But I will definately give your suggestion a try. I don't think it hurts at all to give our kids choices. It's good for them to know they do have choices in life that it is not this and only this. So in the future they know they have choices like when someone tries to give them drugs they know they could either take the offer or walk away. You just hope they walk away But I've heard too many times kids say "I didn't have the choice". Well, if we teach them that there are choices in life then they will know in those circumstances that they DID have the choice. Okay I'm preaching, lol.

Now I have something new to try at home tonight Thanks!

[Schnoogly]

Wow Ashley is amazing! I can't imagine Iain helping to put his diaper on! Usually he crawls away screaming hysterically LOL. It seems like she is pretty advanced verbally and understands a lot too--I mean, mine is 3 months younger but I just can't communicate with him at all. He doesn't say no or anything yet but I'm just waiting for the day Right now he's into destruction--banging, hitting, kicking, mushing food etc. It seems like you're doing the right things, but I think Ashley does sound a little advanced in this regard. This sounds like stuff that would work on a 3 year old not a 16 month old! Choice seems like a pretty advanced thing for this age? Am I wrong? Or does a lot happen between 13-16 months??

I never ask him if he wants to do something. I explain things to him like, see how you're rubbing your eyes and you feel reallly cranky. That means it is time for a nap. And then, two hours later when he still isn't asleep, "Iain, it's time for a ^&&&******&&&ing nap!!! Right now!!!" Yes I know I'm raising a pottymouth but there's only so much one person can take!!

[Maddie&EthansMom]

I know how you feel Karen. Maddie is very high needs and very strong willed. She doesn't give in. Like you, I get frustrated a lot and feel as though no one understands. Until a couple of months ago DH did not understand. Maddie was sleeping in our room, but not in our bed and since she has been sleeping in her own room things have been much better. She feels better, DH and I are getting along so much better and yes, sex is better. TeeHee. I no longer resent him b/c he has helped me with the situation. I figured out a lot of it was him wanting her in the room b/c he felt safer with all of us there. I really had to get tough with Maddie, though. It was hard for me to do and I hated it. I think it is different for a 16 month old, though. Kylie is trying so hard to communicate with you and she gets frustrated, I'm sure. I remember Maddie being just like that before she started talking real well. She still has her moments, too. Kylie is an angel. She is your angel whether anyone else sees it or not. She is just very mischievious and strong willed. I never imagined having a child like the one that I got, but I love her (as you do Kylie) and I do my best with her. That is why we waited so long to have another baby. I knew with Maddie being so high needs that I would never last with a baby in the house. Plus, the hours DH works. I can relate to your every word, but I can also tell you that it gets better. Maddie is a huge help to me (due in part to having to stay busy all the time) and so smart, funny, spunky, affectionate...she is an angel to us. Hang in there. I know it is tough. Maddie was also always fussy around 5 and would stay that way until bedtime.

I hope it gets better for you soon! ((((HUGS))))

[Jamison'smama]

QUOTE (Schnoogly @ Jan 14 2004, 06:35 PM)

I never ask him if he wants to do something.  I explain things to him like, see how you're rubbing your eyes and you feel reallly cranky.  That means it is time for a nap.  And then, two hours later when he still isn't asleep, "Iain, it's time for a ^&&&******&&&ing nap!!!  Right now!!!"

Wow, it sounds like bedtime at my house

I agree--Ashley is advanced, I do offer choices but not with much success. Jamison is not nearly as verbal!

[Maddie&EthansMom]

QUOTE

My major wake up call when Iain was born was that I thought I was the parent and I would make decisions like where he would sleep, what/when he would eat. ha ha ha. I had no idea he would be so strong willed from the moment of his birth, even full of tubes, monitors, and IVs in the NICU he knew what he wanted and demanded it. We are having a discussion about HN on my other board and I'll post the same links in case anyone wants to know more.

Right there with ya! I was the same exact way! I never dreamed I would be 'arguing' with an infant over breastfeeding and everything else. She was difficult from the very beginning. It is so hard and you truly have to do what works for you and your family. Luckily DH and I survived b/c we worked together. That, and he is really good with her. I lose my patience and just walk away most of the time. He is better at reasoning with her.

The good thing about Strong willed children is that they make wonderful, respectable adults. They are great leaders and they always stand their ground. There is something for us to look forward to.

[chloe&tysmommy]

wow!
There is some great advice given- and I hope something works out for you. Chloe is not HN and we don't co-sleep so I'm sorry I have no advice for you but all of the ladies that have responded have given wonderful ideas and great tips.




I hope your situation changes for the better very soon....((hugs))

[Schnoogly]

QUOTE (maddiesma @ Jan 14 2004, 04:45 PM)

That, and he is really good with her. I lose my patience and just walk away most of the time. He is better at reasoning with her. The good thing about Strong willed children is that they make wonderful, respectable adults. They are great leaders and they always stand their ground. There is something for us to look forward to.

This is true for us too--DH is an infinite well of patience. I walk away a lot of the time when I just lose it. It would be ideal if DH could stay home with him--he wants to, but he has the job with the better pay and benefits and there is no job I could get right now (until I finish my PhD) that would cover our expenses. The catch is that there is no way I can finish my dissertation while staying home full time. I can't even wash the dishes, kwim?? Let alone write 200 pages.

And yes, I know all these things will come in handy as an adult--he will be interesting, smart, likeable (he's very social) and persistent in his goals. Can we just skip ahead 4-5 years???

[aspenblue1]

All I can offer is (((HUGS))) Isabella weaned herself around 12 months. She would wake up a couple of times a night to nurse. She was clingy for a while but now she is very very independent.

[MommyToAshley]

QUOTE

MommytoAshley, I would love to hear how you night weaned.

Sorry, I went to post a reply to this early and had to stop to make dinner. Anyways, here is what we did... I hope you find at least one thing helpful.

First of all, I read in several books that some babies have a hard time staying asleep if they nurse to sleep. I guess because they never learn to self-sooth. Other babies have no problem nursing to sleep and staying asleep...but Ashley wasn't one of those. So, my first step was to get Ashley to go to sleep without nursing. I would rock/nurse her until she was on the verge of going to sleep and then lay her in her bed awake. I couldn't do the CIO thing, so I stayed there and held her hand until she fell asleep. (I tried patting her bottom or rubbing her back but she preferred to hold my hand) After a few nights of this, she would lay in her bed, turn over on her tummy and then hold her hand up for my hand. She would grab my hand and then tuck it under her belly and go to sleep. It would just melt my heart. I know this wasn't the ideal thing.... she wasn't going to sleep on her own, but she wasn't relying on nursing either. And, I didn't have to suffer through CIO. Usually it only took a few minutes for her to go to sleep.

Next, we had to come up with a plan on how we were going to handle the night awakenings. We tried several different things, but we finally decided on a plan and stuck with it. We knew that she couldn't be hungry and that she was relying on nursing to go back to sleep. We decided that we would nurse her before going to bed and then we wouldn't nurse her until midnight and then not nurse her again before 5:00 am. I was confident that she shouldn't be hungry until then... especially since she ate such a big dinner. Then, after she got used to that, we cut out the midnight feeding.

When Ashley would wake up at night, DH would go in her room and comfort her. I can't remember, he might have picked her up the first couple of times and rocked her.... but for the most part, he just patted her back and stood by her crib until she went to sleep. I tried to help and comfort her a few times, but as soon as she saw me, she would want to nurse and nothing else would satisfy her. He had the roughest part of it, although I felt guilty for not going to her. But, it wasn't long before she was only waking up a few times a night, and then she started waking up at 6:30 to nurse and then going back to bed until 8:00. She even let me lay her down awake at 6:30am and walk out of the room. Eventually, it got to the point that when she woke up, DH or I could go in the room to comfort her... all we would have to do is say "It's ok honey, go back to bed" and lay her back down.

Next, she gave up the 6:30 nursing on her own. And, finally she stopped waking up through the night. Now, most nights she will sleep from 8:00PM to 8:00AM. If she does wake up, it will be for a reason... she is stuffy or poopy or something like that. And, she goes to sleep on her own too... she doesn't want me to hold her hand any more... I kind of miss that.

When we first started this plan, I never imagined that Ashley would sleep 12 hours straight... not my child! I won't say it is easy, because it isn't. We had some sleepless nights, and I kept second guessing whether or not we were doing the right thing. But, we knew it was important to stay consistent so that we didn't confuse her. I had to deal with the guilty feelings, wondering if she will think I won't be there if she needed me, wondering if it would change her happy disposition during the day. I did give her lots of extra love and attention during the day. And, in the end, it was the best thing we could have done for all of us. She is still the same happy, confident person and we all get the rest we need.

If you have any questions or just need some support when you are weaning her, then please feel free to PM me. I know all children are different... I hope you find something that works for you.

[CantWait]

I'm so sorry you're going through this. Sometimes I think Anthony is bad, he certainly is A LOT more work then Robbie was. I can relate to some of the things you're going through. DH would love for me to stop bf now and it's only been 6 months. He wants his bbs back, he also says if I didn't bf or if I had given Anthony the bottle that he'd take the bottle or sippy cup for him. We've had no life because Anthony only wants me, if dh takes him, he crys and holds his little arms out to me. I just keep telling myself that he just really loves me hmmmm. I also have to take naps with him or hold him or he doesn't sleep.

Maybe it is time to do a mild form of CIO, I know it sucks, I've tried with Anthony a couple times when I just couldn't deal with him for another minute without a rest. I think Kylie is at the age now where she is starting to understand....so instead of screaming, maybe (if you haven't already) you could tell her to "use her words" or "show you what she wants". Let her know that she can't scream and that you won't give her what she wants when she reacts that way.

I really hope things get better for you soon. Big hugs to you