HELP! Major Concerns with Emily!

We took the kids shopping yesterday and then out for dinner. I had talked to Spencer on Saturday about the chores in the house, we printed off some chore charts for Spencer and Claudia and they are both very excited about this. Emily threw hers in the garbage. This is somehting we decided didn't need to be displayed on the wall, we choose to put it in a binder on the desk and are working on some household rules. Spencer has agreed to clean the bathroom and take out the garbage. I told him we would go and pick up some gloves and cleaning supplies. I let him pick out the stuff that he wanted to use and he was right on board. I was also able to get the parental locks on the TV and so far that has worked really well. Spencer can still access some of his shows on the computer. But at least it's not in the living room where Claudia can see them. I also talked to Emily and told her that she needed to clean her bathroom. Marks mother paid a lot of money to have her room renovated, the bathroom renovated and at the beginning she agreed to take care of this. But so far she has not.

Emily informed us yesterday that she did not want to come to the winter reunion with Camp Quality this weekend. This was something we had to register for, this is something that she has known about it for a few weeks now. Emily said she was going to spend the weekend with at my friends house. Mark was under the impression that my friend was still in the hospital and didn't want her staying there. Actually I would prefer if she didn't stay there, the lack of parental supervision is not something I am comfortable Emily being around right now. My friends daughter yells and screams at her mother all the time. My friends daughter has diabetes and does not check her blood sugar levels or take her insulin. This is not a positive environment for Emily to be in. I'm tired of Emily changing her mind at the last minute. Digging in her hells and not talking to us. We asked Emily who her teachers were this semester and she said we didn't need to know. We all sat in the restaurant, Emily with her headphones on, not talking to any of us and texting her friends. We asked if she still needed to go to get binders for the next semester that starts today, she wouldn't answer us. Mark and I talked about Emily after we got home. Her attitude, her behavior, language and her lack of respect for anyone in the family need to change. We decided that she would loose her cell phone, then the laptop, then her allowance and finally all computer privileges if things did not improve. We told her this and had wanted to sit down and talk to her about all of this. But she took the laptop down to her room. So I told Mark that the cell phone had to go. He didn't want to follow through with this, he didn't want to "make waves" in the house. I decided to go to her room and get her cell phone, Mark finally agreed to go to her room. She had locked us out of her room. Mark asked her to open the door, she refused. We tried to unlock the door from the other side and we couldn't. Mark finally got Emily to open her door. She wouldn't talk to us, she wouldn't look at us and she wouldn’t give us the cell phone. She just kept chatting on MSN, I unplugged the laptop (it has very little battery life) and when that didn't work, I took it upstairs. She called me a "f@&%$ng b*ch" she said that I don't live there and she doesn't want me to live there. I didn't hear the rest, as I was heading upstairs with the laptop. I asked my mom to come and pick me up. I decided that Mark and Emily needed to talk without me there. I found out when I got home that while Mark was putting Claudia to bed, Emily came upstairs and changed the password on Marks computer. We can't talk in the house, because the kids can hear everything through the vents. Mark and I were texting each other last night and then Mark told me that Emily was packing. I called my friend and told her that under no circumstances is Emily allowed to stay there and that if she arrives at her house to call the police. Mark told Emily that because she was minor he would have no choice but to call the police if she left and have them bring her back. As far as I know Emily is still at Marks house. Mark and I decided that since she does not want to come with us this weekend and this was supposed to be a family event, she will be spending the weekend with her grandparents (Marks parents) and we will give them specific instructions that she is not allowed to go to my friends house at all. Mark has suspended her cell phone account and plans to call customer service to see what he can do about the password on his computer. Right now, I think it would be best if I stayed away and let Mark try to deal with this. I decided this since I seem to be adding to the problem. I really want to support Mark, but I honestly don't know how I can do that. I'm very sad, very concerned for Emily and I'm really wondering what is going on inside her mind. This is not "normal" teenage behavior. I realize that a lot of Emily's behaviors she learned from me and I would really like to think that thorugh therapy I have changed a lot. I'm calling the Children's Centre today to see if Mark and I can get in and talk to someone there about how to handle things with Emily.

Any advice you have would be greatly appreciated! I'm just at a loss right now. I am very concerned for Emily and everyone else in the house.

Thank You for reading this. I new this was going to be tough, but I didn't think it would be this tough.

I don't have a teenager, but you asked for our opinions, so I will let you know how I think I would deal with it. Of course, when I have a teenager of my own, I may look back at my own advice and laugh at myself.

Personally, I don't think you should leave and let Mark deal with it. I think you need to stay and deal with it along side Mark as a united front. Teenagers say things out of spite, I know I did to my Mom and now regret it. But, if you let Mark deal with it alone, then she will never respect your authority and she may even question your love. Teenagers get mad at their parents for setting rules and following through on the consequences, but they need those boundaries right now. I remember reading a study where teenagers who had no rules or boundaries saw their parents as someone who did not love them or care about them. Teenagers who had rules and curfews felt as though their parents loved them and cared for them. So, even though they fight it every step of the way, they need parental guidance. You did the right thing in following through with the cell phone and the laptop even though she said some hateful things out of anger. But, I do think it would send the wrong message if you give into her and not have her go on your family weekend or not follow through on your other rules/consequences, or if you left now. It's so tough being a Mom.

I think counselign is a great idea. Your family has been through so much with Spencer's illness. I am sure it is common for siblings to feel left out during that time when everything had to be focused on the sick child. Maybe she could have time to speak to her counselor, but family counseling might be a good option too.

I was thinking just what Dee said actually.......

You make it seem like I am abandoning my children. Which I am not. I don't live there and haven't for some time. Right now I am seen as a guest in their house and I am portrayed as the "bad guy" if I do try to set boundries and discipline the kids. I have tried to set boundries and follow through with discipline as I feel that this is important. But right now this is something that Mark needs to learn to deal with. Emily was not allowed to get away with any of this stuff when I was living there and over the years Mark has developed this behaviour (it's easier to say "yes" then have Emily flip out) and even when I did live there, we were never on the same page. I would say one thing and he would let the kids do another or vs versa. So things were not consistant. Mark has allowed the kids to take over the house and has set very little boundries and often doesn't follow through with the consequences. He has admitted to me this morning that he does not like confrontations and that this is something that he really needs to take charge of.

I have talked to my psychologist at great lengths about this and he feels that if I step in and try to change things, Emily will only resent me more. And big surprise it happened. Because I did try to step in and change things. Emily needs to cool off and realize that Mark is the parent and that he is serious about the consequences of her actions.

I am not allowed to call the school and find out if she has attended school, because I am not her primary care giver, they will not release this information to me, I have tried. (looking forward to the backlash to that as well). If she does run away, it would have to be Mark that calls the police and not me. I have told Mark that I will be there for him and that he can talk to me anytime. But right now, Mark needs to step up and take charge.

I have called the Childrens Centre and they cannot offer us counselling. Although the counsellor I did speak with told me that we were doing the right thing, by taking the computer away and suspending her cell phone account. He also suggested that we call the Hospital and try to have an assessment done with the paediatric psychiatric unit. And reminded me that if Emily would like to go for counselling than they can set something up for her. But we know from the past that she will not do this.

This post has been edited by Kirstenmumof3 on Feb 1 2010, 09:19 AM

I will jump right out there and admit myself that I am a "mean Mommy" just so you know where I am coming from.

I am Mortified that your daughter would talk to you like that.
first of all, I would not give her a choice about going on the trip, she is part of the family, the family is going, she is going. End of story.
As for having headphones on at dinner and texting, I would take the phone and head phones away. They are a privilege, not a right, and they should be earned. Having them in during family time is inappropriate and disrespectful. Who is paying for the cell service? I would totally cancel her service until things have improved, and we are talking months not days or weeks here.
She sounds to me like she needs to have her world rocked, a real reality check.
If she were my kid she would already have no phone Ipod, computer, lap top or anything like that. If they want to leave, fine, leave. Let her find out that the world out there isn't so great.

You make it seem like I am abandoning my children. Which I am not. I don't live there and haven't for some time. Right now I am seen as a guest in their house and I am portrayed as the "bad guy" if I do try to set boundries and discipline the kids. I have tried to set boundries and follow through with discipline as I feel that this is important. But right now this is something that Mark needs to learn to deal with. Emily was not allowed to get away with any of this stuff when I was living there and over the years Mark has developed this behaviour (it's easier to say "yes" then have Emily flip out) and even when I did live there, we were never on the same page. I would say one thing and he would let the kids do another. So things were not consistant. Mark has allowed the kids to take over the house and has set very little boundries and often doesn't follow through with the consequences. He has admitted to me this morning that he does not like confrontations and that this is something that he really needs to take charge of.

I have talked to my psychologist at great lengths about this and he feels that if I step in and try to change things, Emily will only resent me more. And big surprise it happened. Because I did try to step in and change things. Emily needs to cool off and realize that Mark is the parent and that he is serious about the consequences of her actions.

I am not allowed to call the school and find out if she has attended school, because I am not her primary care giver, they will not release this information to me, I have tried. (looking forward to the backlash to that as well). If she does run away, it would have to be Mark that calls the police and not me. I have told Mark that I will be there for him and that he can talk to me anytime. But right now, Mark needs to step up and take charge.

I have called the Childrens Centre and they cannot offer us counselling. Although the counsellor I did speak with told me that we were doing the right thing, by taking the computer away and suspending her cell phone account. He also suggested that we call the Hospital and try to have an assessment done with the paediatric psychiatric unit. And reminded me that if Emily would like to go for counselling than they can set something up for her. But we know from the past that she will not do this.

I know that your family has special circumstances, but in MHO, as a non professional, I think that you and your husband need to get on the same page with parenting. You NEED to be a united front in order to make any difference at all. I think that you leaving shows that you are the weak one, and your daughter "wins".

Mean mommy here too - 100%..........I think Emily has learned to take advantage of Marks easy going ways and she needs to understand this isn't the way the real world is!

Sorry Kristen,

Her cellphone service has been cancelled. Mark did it lastnight, but had to do it online so he reported it lost/stolen and then called this morning to change it and suspend the account. She just realized this and texted Mark from her friends phone. I don't know how I would get the iPod away from her she either has it in her pants pocket, her bra or hoody. The dinner out with her listening to her iPod and not texting friends was a first. She doesn't usually do that, they usually eat dinner together. I am very concerned about her and I think I may talk to Mark again and bring her to the hospital for an assessment. If anything she would at least be able to talk to someone. I am also thinking that she may have the same sensitivity to birth control that I had when I was a teenager. She is on birth control because she started menstrating so early (she was barely 9) and has a lot of cramping and migraines from it. I am making arrangements for Claudia and Spencer to go to my inlaws today after school. I worry that Emily may take this out on them (not physically, I hope) and we won't be there after school. I've also talked to Mark and he doesn't want me to be there. He feels that he needs to deal with this on his own.

Sorry, Kristin, I thought you were living in the house again.

Parenting isn't easy, but things are a little simplier when the two parents agree. Rod and I don't always see eye to eye on things either, but we usually have to find some common ground and then stick to what we've agreed on. It sounds like you and Mark need a good talk to set some ground rules and stick to them. You're on the right track with getting together with him to talk, the hard part will be sticking to what you both agreed on.

I think that you cannot let Mark handle this on his own. Present a united front, because if you back down or leave, it gives Emily the impression she can beat you.

I really don't know what you can do. I know if one of my children behaved like that, I would be mad as hell. How long has this behaviour been going for? What have you done to try and stop it?

I like the idea of punishing her by taking away belongings, but it really seems to me that the negatives of her behaviour far outweigh the positives. I am sure she is a lovely girl, I am not saying she isn't. But, the disrespect, the rudeness, not co-operating. It is not on.

If I were you, I would take a very tough love approach. Don't wait until she does something negative to take a belonging away. She has already behaved in an inappropraite way. Take her phone away, her laptop, etc. When she behaves, she can get one of them back.

If she doesn't want to tidy her room, and her bathroom, what can you do? Don't let anyone do it for her. Give her a time frame, tell her you will check her room and bathroom every day to make sure it is clean. If it isn't, warn her once to get it done. If it's not done by the next day, get a garbage bag and put the clothes off the floor, towels, etc. in the bag. Leave it by the door, tell her if it's not put away by the next day and tidy, it's going in the garbage.

It seems harsh, but she should get the picture soon enough. You cannot let her push you or Mark around, or make the house an unpleasant environment. And Mark can't be lenient to avoid trouble, because she is still a child, and in a few short years she will be out there trying to make her way in the world. And the personal attributes she is displaying now will not get her very far in the real world. Don't shelter her anymore, show some tough love and put an end to the unacceptable behaviour.

edited to add: I know you are not living int he house, but I think you and Mark still need to discuss this together. You both need to be on the same page.

.

This post has been edited by Nina J on Feb 1 2010, 07:57 PM

I appreciate all of your comments. But as I found out tonight this is no longer my concern. Mark has made that perfectly clear. I feel completely alone and so disrespected by Mark and Emily. Right now I don't see us reconciling in June. I really don't see me returning to that house at all. Again I feel like an outsider. But hey, I did this to myself. I left them.

I'm going to go out ona limb here and say this much. although i dare say some of it may sound not so pleasent.
your psychcologist is wrong. (don't even get me started on my thoughts on this one)
Mark is wrong.
you HAVE to be involved. I dont care what happend in the past. If a parent is wanting to help their child they NEED to be allowed to do that.
I was a terribly out of control little poop when I was emilys' age. Did exactly what she did. in my family mom was the disiplinarian and she and I would get into fights and not talk for weeks, not see each other for months. This has nothing to do with her birth control. This has to do with the fact that she is a teenager. She is rebeling and when doing this she is screaming out for the love and attention of her PARENTS. They all do this and for some, it's more severe then others. Mark is trying to passify her by letting her do what she wants because he believes it makes her happy. But teenagers want disipline. They want structure and stability.You guys have had to fight so many battles as a family and that is going to put strain on the toughest of people. Right now IMO she doesnt need to feel like there is somthing wrong with her (which is how i would feel if somone took me to a hospital to be evaluated). She needs reassurance and serious tough love. it may mean finding a counsoler with you two (not yours, you need somone impartial)sitting down and having a candid talk with her about what happened to you, to your family, and she is gonna say some nasty things as teens always do, but it may shed light on a starting point to healing for all of you.
I wish you all the best.

I absolutely agree with what has already been said and I would also remove her bedroom door. We have a rule in this house and that is NO locked doors!

Well I totally don't agree I think it is your concern. You might not live in the same house but she darn sure should respect you and so should Mark. He certainly is not doing you any favors by under minding you, he's making the problems bigger! You need to start repairing the relationship now Kirsten or it's only going to get worse.

Well I totally don't agree I think it is your concern. You might not live in the same house but she darn sure should respect you and so should Mark. He certainly is not doing you any favors by under minding you, he's making the problems bigger! You need to start repairing the relationship now Kirsten or it's only going to get worse.

ITA.

What a sucky situation to be in.

I have been seeing my psychologist for the last 7 years. He is very familiar with the situation between Mark and I and I completely respect his opinion. As a teenager I had sensitivity to birth control pills and became very depressed, which went undiagnosed for 10 years (which occurs more than people think). I have also spoken to a social worker at the Children's Centre, the Psychometrist from the Pain Management Program, who in-turn spoke with her sister that is a child psychometrist at the hospital and they all agree that this is more than "normal teenage" behaviour. They all agree that if the situation becomes worse, we as parents have every right to take Emily in for a psychiatric assessment.

And thanks for jumping to conclusions there about my psychologist. He does not do family counselling. We would need a referal to the Childrens Centre and unless Emily agress to go, that won't happen.

Mark will be coming over tonight to discuss things with me.

This post has been edited by Kirstenmumof3 on Feb 2 2010, 02:30 PM

I'm not gonna aruge with you about your dr.
I have been seeing them since i was a kid, they aren't supposed to give an opinion. They are supposed to let you come to your own conclusion on what is best for you threw guidence.
whatever it's against the point. I was just giving my opinion on the situation as you asked.
again i hope for the best outcome.

You didn't do this to yourself, Kirsten. When you say you left, you leave out an important fact: you came back. And, as far as I am aware, you did not abandon your family. You did not just desert them for years with no contact.

Forgive me for my honesty, but you need to give yourself much more credit. Don't put yourself down by saying these things. You are a good mother because you care - you care enough to worry over this, to seek the advice of others, etc. Many, many mothers would not bother to put the time and effort in to this situation as you are.

I think you have every right to be involved in Emily and her situation. Just because you are not living with her and Mark, does not mean you have any less of a right to reach a solution. Tell Mark you want to be equally involved in Emily's welfare. You gave birth to her and have raised her, and have every right to be there for her.

She needs her mother. You are a strong woman and you and Mark can provide the love and support she needs. Why should Mark handle it alone if he doesn't have to? What does Mark want? To further jeopadize the mother-daughter relationship? By approaching this as a united force, you and Mark are showing Emily you mean business, you require respect, and you won't let her suffer. If Mark shuts you out of this, it teaches her her disrespectful attitude gets results.

Do you think you will stand up to Mark and question him about this? I know that you are going to be reconciling in June. Are you hesitant to really stand your ground and speak you mind in case it puts a spanner in the works? Relationships are never perfect and all relationships have there disagreements, but I think there should be no disagreement in this situation. You and Mark are both Emily's parents, you are both fully capable of helping her. There is no reason whatsoever for only one of you to deal with this, and if Mark shuts you out, the fallout from that decision is going to have far reaching consequences.

I really hope things work out for the best. Please, stand your ground and give yourself the praise and credit you deserve. You are a strong woman and you have been through so much. Your children are blessed to have such a wonderful and caring mother

Please keep us updated on what happens, good or bad. We are all here to help you. Take care of yourself

Thank You, but right now I don't feel very strong and I certainly don't feel like a good mother. Mark explained lastnight that he wanted to handle things himself because of how aggressive and threatening Emily is towards me. He wanted to give her a chance to cool of and take responsibility for her actions. Which she has for now. I know that the longer I stay away, the more disrespecful Emily will be towards me and how much of a strain this will put on our relationship. I am going over there tonight, Mark has a meeting, so I will be alone with the kids. I honestly don't know how to handle things with Emily right now. Maybe it will come to me while I'm there!

what sort of custody do you have over the girl? if i remember correctly, you do not live in the US...

Well I totally don't agree I think it is your concern. You might not live in the same house but she darn sure should respect you and so should Mark. He certainly is not doing you any favors by under minding you, he's making the problems bigger! You need to start repairing the relationship now Kirsten or it's only going to get worse.

I agree with this. Aron has never lived with me and doesnt live with me and marcus and anytime jenna disrespects him she is told she better not treat him that way or major consequences. You may not live there and have not for awhile BUT that doesnt give emily the right to treat you the way she does. and mark needs to let u and him be a united front. because if he continues to do what he has been doing emily will only get worse and because mark says this emily probably knows this or has heard him say it so she knows that well dad doesnt think mom has a say so she cant tell me what to do... the first step i think is mark needs to sit down with emily expecially and the other kids and say that i know mom doesnt live here BUT you still need to listen to her and give her respect ... and then the 2 of you need to sit down and figure out punishments, consequences etc

I have nothing except .

I absolutely agree with this method. I was a bit of a terror growing up also but when it came down to my parents, I was never allowed to disrespect them and never did. I might have acted out in my own ridiculous way to teachers and in other situations but as soon as my parents would get involved - it was over. It's tough love. It's not a democracy - you're a mentor, a teacher, and the parents - you make the rules and if she breaks them, there better be consequences!

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